Ever wonder if there is more to yoga than just the yoga postures? Join my guest Eric Shaw for a discussion around his new book called Sacred Thread: A Comprehensive Yoga Timeline: 2000 Events that Shaped Yoga History. Eric’s teachings and passions have been influenced significantly by his teachers, in particular Shandor Remete and Rod Stryker. You can visit Eric on his website at prasanayoga.com and you can purchase a copy of Eric’s new book on Amazon here.
We discuss topics like:
What is the pre-common era?
Yoga sutras and urbanization in India.
Buddha gives us a new philosophy of life.
The difference between consumer consumerism and environmentalism in India.
Mapping connections through language patterns.
Who were the key cultural movers of the Theosophical Society?
The History of the Hatha Yoga Project.
Historical perspective of Krishnamacharya’s story.
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New Student FREE 30 Minute Yoga Meet & Greet ~ Are you new to Native Yoga Center and have questions that you would like us to address? Whether you are coming to In Studio, Livestream or Online Recorded Classes we offer a one time complimentary 30 minute zoom meeting to answer any questions you may have. Schedule a time that is convenient for you. Click Here
Check out this discussion with Jeremy Strickland titled Jin Shin Jyutsu in Rishikesh. Jeremy practices and teaches Yin Yoga and Jin Shin Jyutsu bodywork in Rishikesh, India. Enjoy stories from the heartland of yoga as Jeremy speaks about the power and efficacy of Jin Shin Jyutsu therapy.
During this conversation Jeremy speaks about:
How he decided to live in Rishikesh?
Cranial sacral therapy and massage.
The convergence of traditional Chinese medicine and astrology.
Feeling the pulse of the heart.
Living in the yoga capital of the world.
The wildest thing he’s seen in India.
Jeremy’s bio: Jeremy Strickland is a yoga instructor with a 500 hr RYT certificate from World Peace Yoga School, Rishikesh, India. He brings a light-hearted approach to asana practice, lifting spirits and making the complicated simple. His background is over 20 years as a Certified Massage Therapist in the USA, with a focus on Craniosacral Therapy and the esoteric art of Jin Shin Jyutsu physio-philosophy.
Well, welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast. I’m so happy that you are here. Today I have the pleasure of introducing you to Jeremy Strickland. Jeremy is a Jin Shin Jyutsu practitioner, which is a form of manual therapy utilizing contact points or points of awareness of the pulse in the body. And he is also a yin yoga instructor. He resides in Rishikesh, India, originally from USA, he has a website, check them out at yinyoga1.com. And you can also find him on the IG the Instagram with the handle @yinyoga_jinshinjyutsu. And of course, those links are in the description. Wherever you’re listening, just give a little click and I’ll take you right over. So happy to have this chance to introduce you to people that are experts in the field of yoga, and bodywork from all over the world. Remember that if you would like to practice with us here at native yoga center, in the description and links below, there’s a link for you to join to try two weeks of unlimited live stream yoga with us for free, you can join us for the classes that we offer to the public on a daily basis. And also every Thursday on YouTube Live, I do a free webinar where you can ask questions and so I have a different topic each week. And you can join in and ask questions via the chat box. So there’s a link there as well. You can click on that, check it out. And remember to go look for Jeremy on his website. yinyoga1.com. I hope you enjoy this discussion. Enjoy some cool stories from the other side of the world. Alright, let’s begin. I’m super excited to have the chance to speak with Jeremy Strickland. He’s a Jin Shin Jyutsu practitioner, also a yin yoga instructor. And he’s joining me today from Rishikesh, India. Jeremy, how are you doing today?
Jeremy Strickland
I am fabulous. It’s really exciting to be here.
Todd Mclaughlin
Oh, thanks, man. I’m really excited to have a chance to talk with you. First of all, I’m really curious, how did you land in Rishikesh India and managed to not leave?
Jeremy Strickland
Well, all by happenstance, just before India, I was actually living in Vietnam and Ho Chi Minh City, and I had been there for eight months, I was my first time living outside of the US had had a big life change just before then. And was kind of not doing much of anything, just experiencing life in a new culture, studying language and what have you. And I thought I would get a yoga teacher certificate. I practiced vinyasa and bodywork for 20 years and I have dabbled in and out of yoga classes and had a pretty decent Ashtanga experience at one point. And as I was just out traveling, I thought I should get a yoga teacher certificate so I can see if I can make something happen, you know, and I was going out with a yoga instructor at the time in Vietnam. And she told me to go to Rishikesh. Yeah. And so I just did some research and it was cheaper to fly here and do a 500 hour program than it was to do anything in Vietnam or anything around there. So two weeks later, I’m in Rishikesh, first time in India. I had signed up to do a 500 hour program and ended up staying because I’m familiar with the meridian system that they’re using in yoga. And so the manager of the school that I was out when she found out that I knew the theory fairly well. She said you should stay and teach Meridian theory and the yoga teacher training which is very cool. And so I took off after my program for a couple of months and worked in Nepal and Thailand and traveled around a bit, and was about to start looking for something and she messaged me again. She was like, hey, what are you doing? She said, “You should come back here and do the 100 hour and yoga teacher training and start teaching meridian theory.” And I thought, it sounds like a good opportunity and came back and did exactly that at the beginning of 2019. I was teaching three, four or five classes a day couple of drop in classes, some Meridian theory in the 10 day teacher training program, up until COVID. And then when COVID happened, locked down was pretty intense here. But I didn’t want to go back to the US. And so I just ended up staying nice.
Todd Mclaughlin
How does it work in relation to your work visa? And then with COVID? I know a lot of folks that move to Indo and usually have to do a visa run after either a six month or one year period. Did that enable you to not have to do visa runs?
Jeremy Strickland
Yeah, well before I was just on one year tourist visas. And on the US you have to leave every six months. Yeah. And then we’re just do like a border run to Nepal. But when COVID happened, you they stopped making you leave the country and you did everything online for a while. Yeah. And then eventually, when they started kicking everything back in again. They gave everybody exit visa and told people to leave and so I left and got them. I was the first time and then I went back to the US for five months. That was the first time I’ve been back to the US and like four years.
Todd Mclaughlin
Are you around visiting family and came back like eight months ago? Are you originally a San Franciscan?
Jeremy Strickland
No. Well, originally I was born in Ohio, just for a couple of years. And then I was pretty much raised in small town in Texas. Henrietta, Texas.
Todd Mclaughlin
Yeah, very cool.
And you have a 20 year bodywork history?
Jeremy Strickland
Yeah, I stumbled into massage school when I was about 19 or 20 years old or something.
Todd Mclaughlin
That’s cool. And what is that story?
Jeremy Strickland
So I actually I had when I was a teenager, I was detailing automobiles. My dad was in the car business. My whole life was a child. And so I wound up at 19 years old, I was like detailing cars, grungy, dirty work, didn’t know what I was going to do with my life or anything. And my dad had started managing a bunch of PT schools at this time, and I came home one day and he had a female friend. And I was complaining about being dirty and sweaty and grungy and not liking my work. She said, almost verbatim. She said in six months from now, you could have a manicures license and be working in an air conditioned salon wearing nice clothes and holding hands with girls all day long. And sure enough, six months later, I’m in a salon polishing fingernails and giving manicures and pedicures. And at one point I see a reflexology chart by the pedicure stage. And that was the first time I’d ever seen that or that concept. Yeah. And so I thought, well, I should maybe learn how to do some reflexology, if I’m giving people foot massages for pedicures or whatever. So I called the local school and asked if there was a class. And I say, Well, we talked about it in our massage training program. But we don’t offer it as an individual class. And so soon thereafter, I’m signed up for the massage therapy program. And I went to that was in 1995.
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I am so excited to share this podcast with you. ⭐️ Meet the amazing TARA STILES!⭐️
Tara Stiles is the co-founder of Strala Yoga, best-selling author, and well-being expert. Tara revolutionized yoga for millions, transforming a practice so often seen as dogmatic, and guru-based, into an everyday movement that supports ease and well-being.
Strala Yoga is practiced in more than 100 countries, thousands of Guides lead Strala classes around the globe, and Tara shares yoga with thousands of people on the Strala Yoga app. She has been profiled by The New York Times, Times of India, The Times (UK), and featured in most major national and international magazines.
Welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast. So happy you are here. My goal with this channel is to bring inspirational speakers to the mic in the field of yoga, massage bodywork and beyond. Follow us @nativeyoga, and check us out at nativeyogacenter.com. All right, let’s begin.
Well, yeah, I’m so excited to have Tara Stiles joining me today on the podcast. Tara, thank you so much. How are you?
Tara Stiles
I’m doing good. Thanks so much for having me. I’m excited to chat with you too. Thank you.
Todd McLaughlin
So for those of you that listened to the podcast with Yulady Saluti, she spoke so highly of Tara, that it got me excited to reach out to you Tara and get a chance to speak with you. So thank you for being so gracious in accepting my invitation. I know you have a busy schedule. Are you in New York City currently?
Tara Stiles
Oh, I’m not actually I just got back from Singapore yesterday. But we’re in Illinois. We got this place in Illinois a couple of years ago to be close to family and kind of support everyone here. So we’ll be going to New York in the fall for Daisy’s school. But we’ve been here for a couple of years, kind of based out of hometown America. So that’s been really pretty sweet. Actually.
Todd McLaughlin
Wonderful. Not in Chicago? It sounds more like in a rural setting.
Tara Stiles
Yeah, you got it because you know America. A lot of friends in Europe are like, Oh, Illinois, Chicago. But yeah, we’re pretty far south. So the weather is actually a little bit warmer here than in Chicago. But yeah, all my family’s here. They’re farmers and hanging around the place. So it’s been nice to catch up with everybody and just be together.
Todd McLaughlin
That’s so cool. Is that the town that you grew up in?
Tara Stiles
I didn’t. I grew up a little bit closer to Chicago, but everybody is from here. So my parents got a place down here a few years ago. So everybody’s kind of in the same location. So it’s nice to just be around for sure.
Todd McLaughlin
I hear you, that’s cool. And especially having farm life is pretty amazing. Do they have like a big farm? Are they more like cottage farmers? Do they have chickens and veggies? Are they more of like big time farmers?
Tara Stiles
I mean, I don’t know how big time but kind of all of it. My aunts and all my relatives have gardens and things like that. So come summertime and late fall, you’ve got everything and they can at all for the winter.
Todd McLaughlin
That’s awesome!
Tara Stiles
Yeah, they do the veggies for the personal consuming. And then they do corn and wheat and things like that. I remember a few years ago asking my cousin who’s a few years older than me, she does a lot of the big kind of combining and stuff, and we get to ride along. But I asked her where the corn goes, you know, after reading Michael Pollan’s book and all of these kinds of things. I know there’s a lot of the problems with America, but they found a way to sell their corn for hard plastics and windshields. So I thought that was kind of cool. Just everybody’s trying to do better.
Todd McLaughlin
Yeah, I hear you, that’s amazing. Are you an organic gardener? Or a do you have time for a garden? Or do you just get to benefit from your family’s efforts?
Tara Stiles
To be honest, I would love to. But you know, we’re not here in the summers all the time. I’d love to actually do a greenhouse. I’ve seen that you can kind of buy these pop up greenhouses. They’re becoming more easy and economical and fun. You kind of pop that up in your yard now and just buy these things for a few 100 bucks. And maybe I’ll pop one of those up at some point. You know, see if I can get that going.
Todd McLaughlin
Very cool. What was it like over, you said, Singapore?
Tara Stiles
Yeah, Singapore.
Todd McLaughlin
How was Singapore?
Tara Stiles
Yeah, it was great. This festival called Glow Festival brought me out for about a week and I got to lead classes there, which was really fun. And I’ve been to Singapore a few times. So first of all, it was really fun just to catch up with old friends and new friends and just be back in person with people you know, I’m just one of the millions that are so grateful to just be together with people and and do yoga and they have a great festival and I got to kind of feel like that studio affect again. It was a couple of classes a day and there was other teachers
and other experiences and lots of people. So it was just really nice to hang around and practice and just talk with people and hug people and things like that.
Todd McLaughlin
That sounds really cool. Was it structured sort of like a Yoga Journal type conference where you have a couple of teachers were teaching in different rooms at the same time, or was it one room and then you would take turns teaching with the other teachers?
Tara Stiles
Yeah, it was just one big room and they did this cool thing. It was inside. And they had these large kind of interactive screens that were like almost like a jungle. So they did this really neat tech thing. And at first, I thought everybody would be overwhelmed seeing these screens, but the room was really humongous. So kind of in the distance, you’d see an elephant kind of walking by and things like that. So it was pretty unique and, and fun to just hang around and be together with people for sure.
Todd McLaughlin
Cool. When you had a chance to teach, what type of class did you teach? Did you do like a Vinyasa flow, or what is on the forefront of your specialty these days?
Tara Stiles
Sure, I guess that I’ve always loved to lead. It was a really cool opportunity to have so many different time different time slots, you know, it’s kind of like a regular studio. And they wanted a variety of classes. So some a bit more energetic, some more gentle, some kind of in between. And everything that I love to lead is based in easygoing movement, breath, body connection, this kind of
almost East Asian influence in the yoga, but it doesn’t need to come across that way so much. But really, the idea of moving well comes from Tai Chi and shiatsu and things like that. But everybody usually says, Oh, that yoga class felt really nice. Or I didn’t know I could do something so challenging without forcing myself or It felt nice to move from my center and harmony. So I usually don’t, especially in just an open class, say, okay, now we’re going to be doing tai chi and shiatsu and learning all of these things. I just think that’s, you know, kind of too much located in the mind. So we just move and breathe and, and feel good. In that way.
Todd McLaughlin
That’s really cool. What is your timeline in terms of how long have you been practicing? And how long have you been teaching?
Tara Stiles
Oh, gosh, well, I think like a lot of people’s yoga story, I got really lucky, finding yoga was in my ballet program growing up. So I was thinking I was going to be a contemporary dancer. That was my whole life’s dream. And my ballet teacher brought yoga into our program, I guess I was 17 or 18. And instantly, just like everybody else, felt like this is amazing. And, and then my second thought was, why don’t all my friends do this? Why, you know, I felt like my family, had these values had these philosophical ideas about life. But we weren’t doing this physical practice that I felt could just kind of crack everything open and really guide life. So I just wanted to learn more and share this kind of movement all at the same time. So that kind of just kicked me off and learning more about it. And then at first kind of casually sharing what I was learning with people. And then more and more things led me to doing that with more of my time. So yeah, it’s the beginning of my life, my teenage life
years ago.
Todd McLaughlin
That’s amazing. Can you give me a timeline view of an order of different modalities that you then started to pursue and study?
Tara Stiles
Sure, yeah. Yoga was the first big practice for sure. And then I got to New York pretty shortly after to dance and do other things. But I was always kind of asking people, Hey, do you do yoga? Where do you do yoga, if you don’t do yoga, let’s do a little bit together….. this kind of a thing. And I think because New York has everything I was starting to find shiatsu places, and some ayurvedic practitioners, and all of these kind of, you know, modalities one by one. And I think like a lot of people who have started to learn one and then learn the others, you wonder, okay, are these connected? How are they connected? They don’t appear to be in isolation from each other. How can we, or how can I live in more harmony with myself and not just practice to be more knowledgeable about these modalities, but to integrate them actually in my life and to feel better and live a good life of purpose? And how can I start to communicate that in a sensible way to other people if that starts to make sense to me?
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It is with great pleasure I can bring to you Judith Hanson Lasater, PhD, PT. Judith has taught yoga around the world since 1971. Judith offers numerous live events, digital courses, and has published ten books. Including Yoga Myths, and her most recent book, Teaching Yoga with Intention.
Judith Hanson Lasater is an American yoga teacher and writer in the San Francisco Bay Area, recognized as one of the leading teachers in the country. She helped to found The California Yoga Teachers Association, the Iyengar Yoga Institute in San Francisco, and Yoga Journal magazine.
During this conversation I have the chance to ask Judith questions about her new book, Teaching Yoga with Intention andthe importance of cultivating non violent communication as a yoga teacher.
Welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast. My name is Todd McLaughlin. I’m so happy you’re here. If you’re a first time listener, welcome. And for those of you that have been with me all along, your support means the world to me. I’m so pleased! I feel that my next guest here does not need an introduction. She is a famous yoga teacher, and I have utmost respect for her. Her name is Judith Hanson Lasater, and you can find her at www.judith.yoga.
Judith Hanson Lasater is a PhD. She’s a Physical Therapist. She’s taught yoga around the world since 1971. She offers numerous live events, digital courses, she’s published 10 books. And today the focus of our conversation is speaking about her most recent book called Teaching Yoga with Intention. So I want to express a huge thank you to Judith because she was so kind and accepting my invitation to be here on this podcast. And without any further ado, let’s get started.
Todd McLaughlin
I am so thrilled to have Dr. Judith Hanson Lasater here today. Judith is a PhD and Physical Therapist and a yoga teacher since 1971. Judith, how are you?
Judith Hanson Lasater
I’m doing well. Thank you very much. I hope the same for you.
Todd McLaughlin
I am really excited about this. I actually couldn’t sleep last night because I was so excited for this.
Judith Hanson Lasater
Oh, tell my children that! Or can you tell my grandchildren that? That they could be equally as excited when I call and talk to them.
Todd McLaughlin
Yeah, you can you can tell them that. I hope they’ll listen to you and appreciate that. Well, this is a great opportunity! I got a chance to read your most recent book called Teaching Yoga with Intention, The Essential Guide to Skillful Hands on Assist and Verbal Communication. I’m really excited to get a chance to talk to you about this today. Before we even go down that track though, I’m curious if you can just tell me a little bit about how and what you’re doing these days? Like what does your yoga practice and teaching like these days?
Judith Hanson Lasater
Well, one of the exciting things is beginning to teach live again. Traditionally yoga courses were taught one on one. And it was BKS Iyengar in the modern era who really began, initiated and created this whole idea of classes. But it’s still live, you can still feel the room. When you teach, you can still make eye contact with each person, if that’s appropriate. And so what I’m finding is this huge thirst, to be in community. To be in Sangha. To be with other people and just their presence. Practicing with you in the room is a nonverbal but very powerful support. And we all need that right now. So that’s what I’m liking. And that’s what’s alive for me. I’m very excited about this new book, because I wrote it during the pandemic. It flowed out of me. And that’s always a good sign for a writer.
Todd McLaughlin
I hear you! I think it’s an amazing book. I enjoyed reading it immensely. I found so many great points. I feel like you really honed in on some of the things that when I think, “how would I explain this to somebody?” And I have a loss of words. You did a great job of really laying out the foundation for healthy communication with us both verbally and if we use the power of touch in our in our teaching. So I think you did an amazing job.
Judith Hanson Lasater
Thank you. But before we go into the book, I really would like to follow, I’m all excited, of course to talk to you about, I’d like to follow my tradition of when I speak from the mat, or from the cushion, or in this place from my office chair, that I speak about what I think is, for us, all of us are listening, a really important part of our lives, which is our practice, I’d like to start with a moment of silence,
Todd McLaughlin
That’d be great.
Judith Hanson Lasater
So I’m going to ring my bell. And what I suggest you do is to sit and sit in front of your sitting bones, which brings your pelvis forward and then brings the pelvis under the spine to be like a pot to support this curvy, winding, fine, normal curve. So the brain in the head can float on the top of it. And that physical alignment will resonate through us energetically as well. And then my suggestion is that during that moment, if you find it interesting, useful and or pleasant, just imagine the very center of your brain geographically from the sides of your head from the top and the bottom and the front of the back, the deep center of the gray and just like a wave moving away from the shore, you stay rooted in that not ringing the bells and about a minute I’ll ring them again.
Todd McLaughlin
Wonderful.
Judith Hanson Lasater
All right, fire away with your questions.
Todd McLaughlin
First of all, I love the visual of wave pulling away from shore. That’s, that’s a really beautiful visual that works with that sensation of trying to put your attention right in the center of the brain. Is that something that has came to you? When a while practicing meditation? What made you think of that?
Judith Hanson Lasater
That’s a good question. It just popped into my consciousness one day, and I actually find that I can do that. With my eyes open. And I do it in conversation. I’ll be doing it a lot through our talk. It’s just a very, it takes you away from thinking. Did you notice that? Yeah. Because I have this word I’ve made up. You know, we all know the word mindfulness. But I really liked the word, body fullness. And when we can have, whenever we have the space that we can become aware of sensation, like the weight of our body on the chair, the floor. The sensations of the breath, is when we can cultivate our attention to be aware of the sensation of the moment. We step out of thought, because it’s we stepped from that space into into the present, into the present moment because sensation only occurs in the present moment. You can remember that yesterday you stubbed your toe and it hurt, but you can’t recreate that sensation in the present. So sensation lives in the moment. And when we put our awareness on the body, bodily sensation, we must then not be dancing with thought.
So here’s another technique that arose in me. And it was this idea of the tongue. So let’s try this for a second. Go back to the center of your brain.
And release your tongue from its roots, and let it lie flat in the mouth. Now, when I do that, that deepens the silence for me. Did you find that?
Todd McLaughlin
Yeah, to bring the attention to it or to even just put it right into the mouth, but then try to actually get my tongue to relax? That’s a good one.
Judith Hanson Lasater
No, no, don’t try.
Todd McLaughlin
Don’t try?
Judith Hanson Lasater
Invite. Invite. So here’s what I’ve reasoned out about that is the tongue is not just an organ of digestion, a muscle. It’s also an organ of speech. And so it’s neurologically connected to the speech centers. So we have parts of our brain that are very connected with speech and writing. And thinking because we think in words, have you ever seen a little kid? Or maybe you did this yourself? I remember doing it. When I was learning to write. Sometimes my tongue would be outside my mouth or writing the letter? Yeah, yeah. Because it’s the tongue, you have motor skills. Yeah, babies, infants have to learn how to swallow. They have to learn to swallow. Meaning that with the tongue, and how they nurse and all of that. So I think that when we relax the tongue, and there is some evidence to this, we affect the neural pathways to the brain. And so when I combined, for me, the center of the brain, release the top. Let the heart, expand to its truth. Then descend to the pelvis and feel the pulse of life of being in the pelvis. Thank you, we are then radically present in the being of the body, which lives in the moment. Did you find anything of that in this moment?
Todd McLaughlin
I did! Two things I love right off the bat is the language you used around, don’t try….. instead invite. That’s amazing. That’s a big shift. And then I started thinking, Well, we really don’t have anything to talk about now. Because you got to the heart of it all already.
Judith Hanson Lasater
All will be well.
Todd McLaughlin
You got to the heart of the matter right off the bat.
Judith Hanson Lasater
Can I tell you a story about that?
Todd McLaughlin
Yes, please.
Judith Hanson Lasater
So my second time that I went to Russia, I think I went the first time in ’89. When the wall was coming down, and then again in ’91. And the first time I went, there were just a couple of, two or three Americans there. But then there were a larger group that went and we were in a big cafeteria in one of the big hotels, where we were all staying and then a group of Russian yoga teachers came walking towards us. They came in, you know, and I because I’d been there before. Got up, everyone was like, what did we do what we do? And so I got up and walked towards them. And pretty soon other people started coming and we started introducing ourselves and I remember distinctly talking to a woman and I was doing this southern girl, chatty, chatty. Your city is beautiful, I got it that you know, whatever. And she reached over and she grabbed me by the upper arm. And she leaned into me and she said, No, let us talk a real thing. I love that. That’s what you, that’s what you and I are about I think right now.
Todd McLaughlin
Yeah. Let’s get right to the to the heart of it. That’s amazing. Judith. Well, in your book, you mentioned the importance of language. And you mapped it into like three different stages. Can you please define and explain the three levels or stages of learning about language and the teaching of yoga?
Judith Hanson Lasater
Would you prompt me on that, please?
Todd McLaughlin
I will. Because the first one is how you talked about how first as a yoga teacher, we transfer info “about the pose.” Like the first level of conversation is kind of like, okay, Triangle Pose. And let me just convey some words to help you get from point A to point B.
Judith Hanson Lasater
Yeah, it’s just information. Yeah, it’s like, it’s technique, which is very important, because technique affects energy and organs and state of mind, the nervous system, and we’re very complex. In fact, you know, years ago, people used to say, body, and mind and body were completely separate. That was the western view. And then it started hyphenating, that term. MInd-body. Interesting. You know, and then there was a period, you’d see it written as one word, I see it a lot. Now mindbody is one word. So I’ve made up a word, which is mody. Mody. Because the body and the mind on are so one.
Todd McLaughlin
Yeah, that’s a great word.
Judith Hanson Lasater
Mody. So yeah, I mean, we should get it, we should get it in the dictionary, another word I made up, it’s not just multi-tasking, it is hyper-tasking. So you know, if there, so I want uni-tasking to be in the dictionary. And we, this spiritual practice asked the question, “Can we do one thing at a time?” And usually, the answer is no way Jose. So, yes, the first part of communication is, of course nonverbal. But if we get past that, we’re giving them information. Because if someone comes in and says, teach me how to do yoga, and we just say, do Triangle Pose, we need to tell them turn the left foot in the right foot out, stretch the arm, etc. But that’s not our most important job. So number two?
Todd McLaughlin
The beginning of the personalization of instructions.
Judith Hanson Lasater
Yeah, so a leader in yoga is someone who leads the class. I’ve even seen people turn their back and just do their practice, and people follow them. Which surprises me, so you’re leading. But then teaching begins When you can say to this person, please put your feet wider apart into this next person, would you bring them closer together, when there’s an individuation, of how we can support each pupil expressing the beauty of their Trikonasana in this moment. In ways that keep them safe, and open their heart and mind the same time and bring them into their body into their own self. So that’s a deeper, that’s a real teacher. The teacher sees both the difference and the absolute unity among all people, and to help them help the students. What’s the third one?
Todd McLaughlin
I think you’re correct! You answered that really well, thank you. That when the teacher is able to communicate in such a way that their words evoke, or conjure the pose from the student, or how the student can discover the pose already exists within them. And I love how you wrote as an ancient archetype. That’s so cool. Like the thought of…..
Judith Hanson Lasater
A pyramid. Which is a three dimensional triangle. Yeah, so that presupposes the understanding that we could never teach anybody anything. We can only create an environment in which people choose to learn.
So the question is, how are we going to create that environment with our language? So I make intentional choices. I don’t say good or bad, right or wrong. Oh, I might say to a student, I really liked the way your knee is in that pose, or I’m concerned about placement of your knee, would you try this and see what you think how it feels to you. So because if I come, you know, stomping in the class, and say, do this, do this, do this. And then I learned something and I wanted to change my mind, I’ve painted myself in a corner. So what I want to teach in that part of the of the pose is twofold. The second stage, is like I want to teach them technique in a way that underscores trusting that they trust themselves. First, I want to use my words in a class, to create an environment in which people are trusting themselves and at the same time they’re willing to try something new. And I’m not there to impose the pose to fit them in a cookie cutter. So I like to say to my students, I don’t want to teach you rules, I want to teach you principles. Because that’s a bigger, bigger idea. There are anatomical principles about how the pelvis can move over the femoral heads, in Trikonasana that will relieve the lower back and create a sense of ease and dynamism at the same time. You know that in Patanjali’s yoga sutra, chapter two verse 46, Sthira Sukham Asanam. It’s a definition of Asana. So abiding in ease is asana. So an Asana is that which we can be in which we can be still, and at ease. And it’s really ironic, we think of as movements that are difficult.
Todd McLaughlin
Good point!
Judith Hanson Lasater
How can I create an environment in which people find their Trikonasana? And often it’s not airy fairy? I mean, there are boundaries, there are alignment principle. You could be, you know, hyperextending your knee or whatever, that guidance. But the asana, Todd, the asana isn’t the yoga. It’s the residue, that the asana leaves in the nervous system that is the yoga. Because Yoga is not just, you know, to paint with a broad brush, Asana, Pranayama, meditation. Those point to the potential of presence, which is the state of yoga. So we confuse them. People say I am going to do yoga, like, what? When are we all going to say I’m going to go in my own? Right? And bring that into the world. And bring that. That state of presence. Compassion.
Todd McLaughlin
Great point, Judith. Was there a point in your transformation through your yoga journey where maybe you were practicing a yoga pose and thinking about that yoga sutra, where it’s mentioning that the asana should be stable and comfortable. And thinking, “how in the world could this be comfortable?” I’m in this really like, uncomfortable position right now. And has that informed your teaching and evolution of your practice over the years?
Judith Hanson Lasater
Yes, but it wasn’t a thought. It was an experience, which I’m happy to share with you. So I was taking a class from another teacher. And I was doing what it at that time, for me was my favorite pose, which was Paschimottanasana, which is just sitting on the floor, leg straight and bending forward. Which I think is the hardest forward bend because there’s nowhere to hide. Like, if you’ve bend one knee, if you’ve bend one day like Janusirsana, you can cheat all over the place. But you cannot cheat in Paschimottanasana. It’s you and your hamstrings baby that it is no getting away from it. And it’s also true I think in Urdhva Dhanurasana, and it’s the most difficult backbend. Because when you’re doing one side, Raja Kapotasana, or you’re doing one side of another posture, there is a way to work off to the one side of something in there. Alright, so that was my favorite pose. And I was I like to say I had my hamstrings surgically removed at birth. I just felt like for a long time, and I’m, you know, just sort of naturally a little loose. And so it’s just flat down, you know, forehead on the shins. I mean, I felt a little bit of stretch. But not much, you know, I was pretty comfortable there. And my mind was spinning like what are we going to how long are we gonna be here? What’s happening with that other person doing what I’m going to have for lunch after class, you know, the normal, useless brain chatter. And then there was experience and I want to treat this story with humility, gratitude, and wonder. And I had the sense that something just kind of flew out of me. And I still felt the stretch but I wasn’t doing anything. And I just stayed there. It wasn’t like I even stayed. It was like, there was no deep reason to move. There was no discomfort, there was no agitation. I just stayed there. And finally the teacher said, come up, and I didn’t come up. Because I didn’t know what that meant. Literally, it was so bizarre. He said, come up, and I’m like, what does that mean? Because he was, it would be as if I were saying to you stop jumping up and down. Yeah. And you know what? I’m not jumping. Yeah. So he said, stop doing the pose. And I’m like, what is he talking about? And then this little ego stuck it’s head out behind the tree and my consciousness and said, Wow, that was cool. I started, you know, then it shifted again. But I thought to myself afterwards, well, I’d finally practiced one pose. It was my first pose, you know, it was years into my practice, but…. So, does that answer your question does?
Todd McLaughlin
Yes. Perfectly. Since I’ve read your book, I’ve been extra thoughtful about my speech and my touch, in a good way. In a really good way. Like, maybe I was just on autopilot for a little bit. I kind of forgot how important it is. And you made mention, in your book, this is quoting you “we speak to manipulate the world around us” end quote. Can you explain that? It makes sense to me. It makes sense to me, but love it. I thought it was actually kind of profound when I heard that. We speak to manipulate the world around us. I might think, “I’m not trying to manipulate the world.” I’m just getting through the world here. So I love that sentence.
Judith Hanson Lasater
Okay. So first, let’s look at the word manipulate, because that has a negative connotation. But if we’re truthful, Todd, you are manipulating the world around you all day long. You go for a run, you’re manipulating your consciousness, right? Go for a run, you smoke a funny cigarette, you smoke a real cigarette. Not that you do these things. You have coffee, you want your caffeine which manipulates your nervous system. You do your Pranayama or your yoga. You stand on your head, all this manipulate your nervous system. You go to sleep and that manipulates your nervous system. We’re always seeking homeostasis. In fact, you are choosing, you know, when you eat, you feel different. You manipulate your nervous system. That’s what human beings do. And there are two kinds of manipulation. There’s the unconscious one and the conscious one. And so to me, that’s what yoga is about is paying attention to how doing Savasana. Savasana manipulates your nervous. Does it not?
Todd McLaughlin
It does.
Judith Hanson Lasater
Okay, so that’s a conscious manipulation. So the question is not, should I not manipulate, it’s am I doing it consciously, to live my highest values. And that’s what yoga makes us aware of. And this speech that I’ve that I’ve studied this technique of nonviolent communication has radically changed my relationship, in my interaction with my children as they were growing up, and in intimate relationships and in teaching.
And the best way we can do that. Well, let me let me let me back up a second.
Every time I go to teach, whether it’s online or in person. The first thing I do is have the one minute. And during that one minute I connect with myself. This is the first rule of teaching. When I sit there in front of you today or in class. The first thing I do is I ask myself this question. What is alive in me right now? Am I anxious? Am I happy? Am I sleepy? Am I irritated by the discussion I just had with someone? It doesn’t really matter what is arising in me but when I get connected with that. Oh right now I’m tired or right now I’m excited. Right now I’m worried about one of my children. It was always one of the three was at the top of the worry list, you know, over the years. Whatever, whatever is arising in me when I notice it. That when I bring it into the light. It connects me with the present moment. And I go, Ah, yes, I’m feeling excited. Ah, I don’t judge it. I don’t try to make it different. I don’t try to fix it. I just notice it. Because, and name it to myself. Right now I’m sad. Because my uncle died. I’m just sad right now. Okay. That’s what’s alive in me, then I’m firmly present. Radically present I call it because we’re very rarely there. So the next thing I want to do is I want to be able to see you. And I can’t see you and or connect with you if I’m not connected with myself. So when I see you, and it’s really tricky, because I’ve taught for 51 years. I have students who’ve been with me for 45 years.
Todd McLaughlin
Wow, that is amazing!
Judith Hanson Lasater
You know everything about them. You know them before they met their husband, before they got married, when they got divorced, and they had these kids, and they had this surgery, then this. And so it blurs in a way, your objectivity. So when I go to teach somewhere where I don’t know, most of the people, I sometimes feel that my best teaching. Because I don’t see my friend. I see a human being, you know what I’m saying? You may know what I am saying. So that. Yeah, so the second part of this is I want to see the person standing in front of me. They may have been there for many weeks, or never again, but can I be present with that person in this moment?
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